HOW TO: Find Your Center Between Competing Passions (w/ Alaman Diadhiou)

[00:00:00] Speaker A: Through the music that I'm performing or through the performances that I do. Really, this isn't limited to music for me. I just want people to come to me for profound feeling and experience. Right. Whatever. Whatever the emotion is. Right. It might not be happy one day. It might not be sad one day. It might be the inverse. However, if people can come to me and say, oh, I want to feel whatever he's expressing, and I want to connect with that. Whatever I'm feeling right now, I want to use his art, his material to really dive and get that extra, you know, 10, 15, 20% of whatever that is in a moment. I want to be an artist that's known for really translating feeling. And then. [00:00:44] Speaker B: I'm Luke Steinfeld. [00:00:45] Speaker C: And I'm Wyatt Sarkisian. [00:00:46] Speaker B: We made the 5050 podcast to support you on your filmmaking journey. [00:00:50] Speaker C: 50% business, 50% creative. [00:00:52] Speaker B: Every Tuesday, a new how to. [00:00:54] Speaker C: This week, we talk with singer, songwriter, actor, d dancer, choreographer, and friend of the pod, Alaman Jaju. It's a good one this week. [00:01:10] Speaker B: So you're spinning the plates, though. It's not like it's like, let's really focus on this one pot and, like, dig in and then ideally establish there and branch out. It's instead, let's just push on all fronts. [00:01:24] Speaker A: Yeah. And I think the idea is, for me, like, being exactly. It's like, I'm functionally able to narrow it down and say I'm open to performing in each of these spaces, but I do want to be performing in a way that emphasizes that, like, I am unique and I am, like, the one person that can be doing this type of thing. Right. [00:01:45] Speaker B: Theater, music, film, tv. Those are the three. [00:01:49] Speaker A: Exactly. Okay. Exactly. Yeah. And like, the very, like, damn near. It's like we've, like, revolved around back to, like, what, like a quote unquote, like, star or featured performer was in, like, the 50s who had, you know, theater career, had, like, you know, like the big tv, musical, like, film musical kind of thing, and then also had, like, the music project to go along with it and, like, an album of records that you could get. Like, I would say that that's sort of the model. So in the sense that it's like, that's something that we've strayed away from industry wise. I feel like it's not necessarily because. [00:02:23] Speaker C: We'Ve started siphoning people a little. [00:02:26] Speaker A: Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, I feel like there was a time where, like, somebody like a Timothy Chalamet, like, they would have been like, yes. You also like, let's make you an album, you know, like, kind of like the Elvis strategy. And like, regardless of if that works well or not, right, Like, I do think there are really good examples of it. And like, at least career reference points for me are like a childish Gambino or an Ariana Grande or even a Bruno Mars, you know what I'm saying? Who are these people who have like the successful, you know, music media project, but then are also like kind of like one of one in their own lane, Be it Bruno in Vegas, be it Gambino as like a creative, like, mind and conduit both on and off camera. And then you have Ariana who's like super pop but also like Oscar nominated. Exactly, you feel me? And it's like a part of like, you know, I think people might not look at it this way, but at least to me, like, Wicked is like, I feel like one of the biggest franchises since like, a Marvel instead. And in terms of like a concept, right, like, we're like breaking a big and massive kind of ip, you know, that obviously is musicals, but, you know, I'm saying, like, if you, if you take away like the superhero ness of. It's like, this is just a massive thing. Like, there are only a few type of artists that can like, jump between mediums like that. So definitely that interdisciplinary thing. [00:03:48] Speaker C: What character are you vying for in Wicked to be star in the spin off movie? [00:03:53] Speaker A: Oh, that's a good question. I feel like the box spin off would definitely, like, like, people will go and watch that. [00:04:01] Speaker C: I mean, yeah, absolutely. [00:04:02] Speaker A: You feel me? Like, you can like, build a whole. [00:04:04] Speaker C: Like, lore out of that very specific tone for. [00:04:07] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, but who would I want to see? I don't know, Like, I don't know. I would want to see whatever, like Oz spin off. Like, personally, they, like, like, what. What is. What is the wizard in that universe up to, like, for a full two hours, you feel me? Like, what does he get? What is he on? Outside of the context of the witches? [00:04:27] Speaker C: I like, I liked how they featured the townspeople so much in the movie. I see something there with like, regular. What's it like, you know, living in like, that sort of under that sort of government, you know? Like, that's. That's interesting. Okay, well, let's get into it. [00:04:44] Speaker A: How do you guys start normally? [00:04:45] Speaker C: Well, I think. I think. I think we've started already, I think, because I want to reference the first question that Luke asked, which is like, where are you in your career right now? Like, what's he was Kind of asking like, what's your main focus right now? And I think for as long as I've known you, you've, you've, you haven't had that sort of like, this is the end goal, you know, it's been like, I want to do this, I want to do this, I want to do this. I relate to that a lot in terms of, like, what is, like in an interview, right? Like, what is that thing that I can say that's like a tangible thing that's like, I want to do this. Like, I want, instead of, I want to be writer, actor, producer, you know, for you, songwriter, singer, dancer, performer, actor, like all these things, you know, so it's, it's, it's tough, it's tough to nail you down, which I think is like one of the most special parts of you. A little intro. This is Alamon, everybody. He's been a close friend of Luke and I's, for God, I don't know, probably since, probably 10 years now, right? [00:05:56] Speaker A: It is, what I was going to say is actually. 10 years. [00:05:58] Speaker C: Yeah, 10 years now. And we've, you know, you know, done various artistic stuff. I know Alloman and I did theater stuff in the past. I know Luke and Alomon have done music stuff and other forms of collaboration. And you've just been like a good, you know, steady friend for more than anything. Just like a steady friend who, you know, you would always come to New York and stay with me when you were, you know, going to school at Yale and I was at nyu and, you know, we always see each other when we're in LA. So welcome to the pod. You're a friend of 5050 and thank. [00:06:29] Speaker B: You for having me all I want to, I want to, I want to ask about the artist camp. [00:06:37] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:06:38] Speaker B: Just were at. Because I, I, I think it's such an interesting concept and I've always, like, heard about it and I've always been like, God, that sounds really interesting and cool of like a little retreat or something of where it's just like a big, like, brainchild or something of like, you know, a few people coming together and collaborating. [00:06:55] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:06:56] Speaker B: Would love to hear about your experience and obviously that being your first one too, of like, expectations, reality with that. [00:07:03] Speaker A: No, it was, it was really crazy. It was kind of, you know, as the music industry can be kind of like nebulously constructed and set up and there wasn't really much said prior, but the one thing I communicated to these folks who reached out to me and said, hey, we want to work on your music project and get you, like, a group of songs or at least contribute to your project in such a way that we don't feel like is being expressed yet. I was kind of like, you know, I would love to go and do that. I would love to see what that's like. And they were like, okay, this is the studio we're going to be here for these days, and so long as your schedule's clear, ours is, and let's get to work. So as far as that went, you know, it was myself a producer, two writers and an engineer. And basically how we started, and sort of an executive producer, creative, kind of like leader, mentor of mine who brought me in. But the sort of start was just like, you know, sitting together. We'd never met before. They had seen some clips of me performing. I made some, you know, little vocal samples of myself singing so they could get a sense of my voice, a sense of what key might work or what keys, I should say might work. And we kind of just talked about, like, my essences as an artist, the things that I sort of care about. You know, I'm saying I think the sort of backdrop for myself, be it, you know, music, dance, whatever. I started as a dancer and still dance at a very high level. Tap dance is one of my specialties, but I also kind of, you know, perform across genres. Group dancing in the Debbie Allen Dance Academy. I'm doing all styles, like a conservatory context. I'm letting them know this. I'm also telling them I'm from, you know, the Leimert park area, you know, part of the Crenshaw district in la. So that's kind of like the background of my cultural upbringing here, but then within the home. My family is from Senegal, which is in West Africa. And so I sort of have this intra sort of communal connection with my roots, like, you know, be it speaking Wolof, speaking French and whatnot, eating Senegalese cuisine, understanding the sort of, like, societ and moral ethic there, but then having that sort of juxtaposed with black culture as it's constituted here in the United States, Big mouthful. How do you process that into a singular artist? And we kind of like, are you. [00:09:36] Speaker C: Saying, so are you. When they. When they ask you for who you are in terms of your vocal techniques and your range and your. And the stories are telling through your music, Right? That's essentially, you know, where you're from, where your family's from, all that. Like, are you. How are you conveying this to them? [00:09:52] Speaker A: I'm. I'M doing my best to, you know, say it, as I'm saying to you. But also if. If, you know, like, kind of letting it be like a. It was kind of like an open discussion to start. [00:10:01] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:10:02] Speaker A: And then from there they kind of get, you know, more into ways where it's like, okay, how do I. They might, you know, stop me and be like, I want to hear more about this, I want to hear more about that. And then at a certain point they ask like, okay, what if you, in your, like, you know, dream, at least in terms of this artist project, like, what do you want to be? Like, one of the. What do you want people to come to listen to you for? Like, what are they? Are happy? Is it sad? Is it whatever? And the follow up question is, what type of message or what type of experience do you want to get from what you're performing? Right. And we kind of arrived at these answers for me at least, is that through the music that I'm performing or through the performances that I do? Really, this isn't limited to music for me. I just want people to come to me for profound feeling and experience. Right? Whatever. Whatever the emotion is. Right. It might not be happy one day, it might not be sad one day. It might be the inverse, however, if people can come to me and say, oh, I want to feel whatever he's expressing and I want to connect with that. Whatever I'm feeling right now. I want to use his art, his material to really dive and get that extra, you know, 10, 15, 20% of whatever that is in a moment. I want to be an artist that's known for really translating feeling. And then in terms of material. Well, wait, so. [00:11:30] Speaker B: But from that, like, so you're kind of setting the stage for them of like. And this is really interesting because you're kind of reverse engineering with intention, obviously, of the message you want to get out of, which is very similar to writing a script or to making a pitch deck for a movie. Just, it's just having an idea or a message and thinking about how to actually get there. So then with that, like, how are you. What are they starting to think? Like, okay, so here are comps. Like, here are artists that are kind of doing that right now with similar messages. And let's think about that sound. Or is it then like, okay, how do we just, like, take all of this? I mean, I guess I might be jumping ahead here, but like, yeah, what are they? What are they? Are they then pushing back to you and being like, so then how. What does that sound like, or you asking them, what does that sound like? [00:12:19] Speaker A: Like, I mean, I think, I think we asked those questions of each other for sure. And I think the thing that I told them, I was like, it was really open ended. Like, there's no real 1, 2, 3, 4. There's not, there's not like a finite amount of concepts that I want to tackle with what I'm performing or what I'm saying in a narrative context. I just want to be able to believe in what I'm performing. I told them that, like, that's what matters to me at the end of the day. Like, I would much rather look at my career, say 50, 60 years from now and be able to say everything I've done, I've believed in. Or at the very least, once I get over the hump of like breaking in the projects that I'm a part of and the things that I'm expressing myself, I can stand 10 toes down and say, I believe in these things. Right. And so when we get there, from what does that sound like or what are artist references or musical references? Obviously there's a very breadthy sort of cultural base that I'm able to pull from and historical base, be it jazz to R and B to West African, Senegalese music that's in Balaj, or the music that I grew up from, grew up on, from other countries. You know, I'm saying Kofi Olamide and you know, Cameroonian music, Congolese music and whatnot. Music that kind of stretches into the Arab world and whatnot and has this sort of like massive world tradition. Right. Like, I'm down to tap into all of these things. And some of that they might know, some of that they might not. But at the very least they were able to establish like wide bounds, but have some semblance of bounds for how we would go forward. And we were able to finish five songs, which was really crazy in a matter of like, wow, three days writing, you know what I'm saying? Just going back and forth, thinking about concepts, thinking about the stories that we. [00:14:02] Speaker B: Want to sell, fully mixed and stuff. [00:14:03] Speaker A: Or more of like fully fully composed demos, I think mix. And all those finalization type things are going to be a later thing, but like, you know, like backgrounds fully tracked, you got, you know, your verses, your choruses and whatever. It was definitely the fastest I've. I've been able to be a part of an experience where you're making that music. But it was particularly fascinating and what I should say is, at least as far as my music Project goes. I definitely think where we are currently in terms of the black diaspora, we have communities in conversation with one another that haven't ever been able to before because of things like TikTok, because of the Internet. And I think, structurally, black communities have been separated by, you know, where they were brought to via the transatlantic slave trade, via language that they speak, languages they now speak. Right. English and French or Spanish or Portuguese. Right. Like, it's hard to relate with people whose language you don't share, even if you're traced to the same place three, 400 years ago. However, we have this access, music as a universal language. We have this access to understanding allegories across different spaces. I can hear a drum groove in Brazil and be like, oh, shoot. Like, they were doing that, you know, in sub Saharan West Africa or whatever. [00:15:23] Speaker C: Wow. [00:15:24] Speaker A: I think, personally, if. If, like, the greatest success of my music project, I think, will be creating conversation between black communities and then just communities at large that have been separated by structure, separated by empire. You know what I mean? Very much so. It would be awesome to be, at least for my generation, one of the premier artists of the black diaspora who has this, like, active and conscious understanding or at least understanding of his own mission. Right. That's to, you know, create a conversation that otherwise wouldn't have been happening. Right. That's how I feel like I'm able to work against history, do my job, and say, no, you actually do deserve to understand that this is your cousin or this is your brother generations back, regardless of what you know, these flags and these borders that we live within tell us, you know? [00:16:20] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:16:21] Speaker A: Moving from that, though, I would say, and now hopping into a separate frame. I've done choreography for three massive music videos this past year. Two for this artist, Maddox Batson, and then one for an artist named Kanii, all of whom are signed to. Or both of whom, I should say, are signed to Warner Records. And the person who commissioned these videos is our colleague and friend Ben Hanning. He brought me in to work on these projects, Right. And it's fascinating to see an artist at that stage of their development, what it's like to have these whole productions, to have marketing meetings and media strategies all built around music and. And. And a sort of, like, artist ethos and narrative, what they're trying to, you know, promote about themselves. [00:17:13] Speaker C: Yeah. What's. What's the narrative? I mean, that. [00:17:16] Speaker A: Right, That's. [00:17:17] Speaker C: That's marketing, right? It's like it's creating narrative around something. [00:17:21] Speaker A: You know, and then being the one who's trusted to, you know what I'm saying, like add physical movement and performance and like engage folks and hopefully, you know, offer some steps that people can catch on to in like a tick tock trend, fashion, you know. So seeing that and being a part of it, I think I am super grateful that I'm able to engage with the industry and with like sort of pop music or, you know, other stuff that we'll get into, be it theater, be it film and tv, sort of being able to jump between on camera talent as well as creative team responsibilities is like one of the most valuable things. Because I can, I can see that. I can see, you know, something that's, you know, more realized or at least further along in the process and then jump into the studio and really like have a consciousness about, okay, like this is the type of song that would work for this video or this is the type of thing that I will want if I'm hiring a choreographer, if I'm hiring a dp, if I'm hiring a director or I'm working with a label or I'm working with whatever. I get to see the ways in which, you know, things firing on all cylinders do really well, or there might be shortcomings, or you might see an artist or a creative, like a director or whatever, saying, I wish we had been able to do this, wish we had been able to do that. It's kind of like Loki being able to have a cheat sheet because I'm able to, you know, obviously do my job, but also learn and watch, you know, the shoes that I'm eventually going to fill. [00:18:47] Speaker C: Absolutely. It's filling all those roles. Right. I think it's so vital. Something that I, I really think is so important. And we were talking about like, you know, staying in one lane or going in different lanes. Like you, you as you're a performer yourself, you know, so you're thinking from the perspective, okay, if I'm choreography, if I'm choreographing this. [00:19:08] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:19:08] Speaker C: What would, what would I want as a performer? Like how do I want to be communicated to or what steps do I think are good? So it's exactly. Can you speak to that value of, you know, having filled multiple roles on that, on those sets and things like that, like speak to the value of, of, you know, the, the opportunity to be part of multiple positions on things. [00:19:30] Speaker A: I think, I think at least one of the things that made, that's made me most successful when I'm dealing with an artist who has less live performance experience is I'm not telling Them what I think will work. I'm telling them, yo, I've been in your shoes. Like, I totally understand what's difficult about this, and I know that comfortable comfortability is number one, right? If you look busy, if you look like, you know, you can see somebody thinking. And this, this works with sports, too. We played sports together, you know, I'm saying, throughout high school, right, when you're watching a guy or you're guarding a dude and you can see that he's thinking or he doesn't know what he's going to do, like, you smell blood and audience members are the same way. Very, very fickle, very easy to turn on somebody who doesn't seem confident in what they're doing. So what I say is, listen, I've been where you're at. I've learned through years and years of experience, right? Performing professionally since I'm like 6 years old. The first thing we got to go for is ease and command of what we're doing. And I'm not going to give you anything that you can't do. And I'm not going to be like, we have the same goal here, right? So it's building that trust and speaking from experience, you know what I'm saying? I think, like you said, right, like, there is an actual value. I think the point of that value is understanding that it's, you know, you can tell somebody what you've been through and share with them and like, like, you know, both teach from and lean on your experience as anecdote. You know, sort of like, you know, being able to talk through it, you know what I'm saying? Like, I was, you know, I've worked with a couple folks. Sort of the last artist that I work with, Kinney, he really loves Michael Jackson. Well, for the latter part of last year, I was playing Michael Jackson in the Broadway national tour of MJ the Musical, right? So while I'm not Michael Jackson, did I have the entire training available to me and also did I log shows using that movement and singing up in the rafters and do whatever? I was like, listen, man, I get it. It's super hard to move this way. There's a reason why Michael Jackson is considered the greatest entertainer of all time, but he also had a plan and a regimen and had people that he worked with and choreographers and reps and reps and reps. And so, you know, so long as you can actually make practical and understandable and translate, like the thing that you're trying to, you know, bring about for another performer or for somebody that's in a role. Right. I don't know. Like you guys have been, you guys have worn many hats from like. [00:22:02] Speaker C: Well, if, yeah, if I'm giving someone feedback on a script, I know how I like to receive feedback. I know which part, parts as a writer, I'm willing to, to change and what not to change. You know, if you're, if you're giving feedback on, you know, the theme and the essential story, that's a lot harder than giving feedback on. Let's, let's punch up this character, let's make them seem more vivid or things like that. So it's definitely like, you know, these. [00:22:25] Speaker A: Consonants are hard for me. Can I shift this, you know exactly that to a witch or something like that. You're going to understand what it's like to like, like the feeling of the words in your mouth and how they pop out and like, you know, what works and what's more efficient. Luke, as well, you have experience with the camera. You've DP things, you've edited, things you've directed, things you've written. And I genuinely do think like, the more hats you can wear, at least so long as you commit yourself to doing as best you can with them, like you're also going to be able to, you know, have empathy and understand what the people that you're collaborating with are going through, their shortcomings or their advantages. And you can actually utilize those things when it comes time to, you know, create something that costs money within a 12 hour bound. [00:23:14] Speaker B: You know, one, one thing about you, Almond, is aside from you being incredibly smart, which I honestly don't know how much of that. [00:23:26] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:23:28] Speaker B: Why it's giving a not so much look, but I have the ChatGPT implant. Yeah, the Chat GPT implant. [00:23:35] Speaker A: That's right. [00:23:36] Speaker C: Hello. [00:23:38] Speaker B: Your work ethic, man. And that's something that's been present throughout, for those past 10 years that we've known you and stuff. And in high school, you doing the amount of work I remember you not sleeping to finish crazy assignments and doing all of this with crazy after school activities with dance and, and sports and all of it. But I want to lean into dance and like hear how that is like. Or did that teach you? Is that where your work ethic comes from? Like what did, what did or what does dance continue to like, teach you? Because that at least to me feels like where it all started. [00:24:15] Speaker C: Foundation. [00:24:15] Speaker A: Yeah, for sure. Yeah. It's a really good question. I appreciate that. It's very kind of you to say. I'll give the short, like, backstory of how I got into dance and then what it taught me and what it's given. Because I, I do think my dance education is, is foundational to like my work ethic and professional ethic and even academic ethic, you know. So basically I was, you know, I was a kid that was full of energy, was always trying to do stuff anytime, anytime there was a thing that you gave me, if it was a puzzle, if it was like a, you know, some physical thing, if I couldn't do it, like, it would upset me. And I would, you know, spend all my energy until I had to go to sleep to try and get this thing. And then if I didn't get it, I'd go to sleep and God forbid I didn't have it the next day or else I'd go insane. Right. So gymnastics was a thing that my mom put me in at the recommendation of very close family friend. I did that for about two years, two, three years. I was actually very good at gymnastics. I ended up being for my age group in California. [00:25:22] Speaker C: How old were you? Like four, five? [00:25:24] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like four, five, six. [00:25:26] Speaker C: Yeah. Huge competition, right? [00:25:28] Speaker A: That was my first time at, at Brentwood, actually. The Peter Vidmart 10 years after, they're. [00:25:34] Speaker C: Like 14 year olds in the Olympics, so. [00:25:36] Speaker A: Oh, they're crazy. [00:25:37] Speaker C: It starts early with that. [00:25:38] Speaker A: So, yes, 100%. So it was super serious, like very serious Eastern European coaches. But down the street was a dance academy where all of the drummers were from Senegal. So the West African dance, like, kind of education was centered around, you know, my culture. My mom was like, you should be going over here. You can do this. You'll be working on your flexibility, you'll be working on your rhythm, and you'll also be getting like, you know, some cultural immersion. So thank goodness to my mom. Yeah, for everything. But especially for that, you know, because I wouldn't be dancing without her, of course. So I then start at Dada Debbie Allen Dance Academy. And there you can't just pick and choose which classes you take. Like, if you're going to take electives, which are like the fun classes, hip hop, tap dance, African. You also have to do the core curriculum of ballet, modern, jazz, you know, other more particular American modern dance techniques. So it's kind of like a, if you want one, you got to get them all, right? So I do a semester of that. Um, obviously really like it, but I'm still like, you know, a child and just getting into it. And Dada was expensive. So after One semester, my mom pulls me out, right? It's like, okay, we're just gonna go back. That was great. You're gonna keep grinding with gymnastics. And Debbie actually called her personally and was like, where is he? I'm. I'm doing, like, my annual show. Where's. Where's your son at? And she was like, oh, you know, like, he. He wants to take a break. She was like, why does he need a break? He's a child. She's like, well, honestly, it's very expensive. And right there, Debbie put me on. Or she said, Ms. Alan put me on a full scholarship. And I was a full scholarship student from then on, so. Also would not be dancing without her. Her school's mission, her generosity. And now I'll just get into sort of her philosophy surrounding dance and academia. Right. Something she used to tell us when we were young is how she grew up in Texas. She was born in Texas when Jim Crow was still in place and perpetuated and Texas was still segregated. And she would go to the dance school or, like, walk outside it, at least. And it was all, like, little white girls in ballet. And she would watch, and she wouldn't be allowed to go in. Actually, crazy enough, I think Patrick Swayze's mom was the ballet teacher at this school, and one time was like, no, you can come. Like, she saw her watching every day and brought her in. But between, like, you know, people breaking the rules and generosity and her having to cross the border to go to Mexico to train and dance, Whoa. She really has this, you know, underlying experience wherein she was like, okay, I know I have this greatness in me, but it's being denied to me because of factors that are out of my control. Obviously. You know, I'm saying I didn't grow up under those conditions. It was, you know, financial barriers. So her situation is way, way crazier, and that should be acknowledged. However, I would say her perspective is definitely founded upon that. That underlying experience where regardless of talent, regardless of, like, volition, she was denied. And so she kept that with her and was very often the, you know, the first black person or black woman in the position that she was in. Totally on Broadway. People don't know things like this, but she was. She directed the first ever episode of the Fresh Prince of Bel Air. [00:29:14] Speaker C: Wow. [00:29:15] Speaker A: So she's one of the first black women. Huge. To direct massive TV shows like this. Now she's, you know, directing Grey's Anatomy and also in IT and things like how to Get Away with Murder and, you know, I can't even list her whole resume. It's insane. Was she teaching classes? [00:29:32] Speaker B: Was she teaching? [00:29:34] Speaker A: She was, she would, I think perhaps when she was really getting the school started, which is like around the time that I was born, she was probably teaching more because she obviously has so much that she does. But bringing it back to this, this point about work ethic, she ended up going to college and studied the classics at Howard. Right. And she is very, very academic about the way that dance is taught and is understood. We had to keep a notebook with us and write down the French terms for technique and ballet. We had to always know what stage directions meant. And we were never too young to be asked a question that we were responsible for by her in a professional context. [00:30:22] Speaker C: So there's a huge academic side to this dance. [00:30:25] Speaker A: Huge academic side to it. And you know, obviously when you're young and you cling to something and you have aptitude, like that can take you far. But you know, the difference definitely was how much you loved it and also how much time you were willing to put in outside of class. But we were at Dada seven days a week. Like school would end, class started 3:30 and we didn't leave until 8 and then went home and did homework. And this was every day and then all day Saturday, all day Sunday. [00:30:53] Speaker B: It also sounds like a respect thing though, like for the art form itself. And I, I mean from hearing a bit about her background, it makes sense of like, you guys have this incredible opportunity in front of you. I'm not going to let you waste this, you know, and it's like, exactly. And I think there, that's really, that's really powerful, like mixing that respect way. Like it's, I don't know, it's easy to be passionate about something but like, I think there's another level of passion that like leaves that respect when it's like you want to like learn about these French terms or like the history of something or like this for sure, you know, that, that kind of thing. That's, that's really interesting. That's cool. [00:31:32] Speaker A: Yeah. And it's like being in that school, it's like you're, you're given these tools, right? Like you have this being made available to you. Why not make the most of it, right? And so learning how to do that at Dada was then something I could very easily apply, apply. Like I was obviously an academic kid and loved, you know, books, reading, science, math, whatever, but I could apply this at Brentwood. I can then apply this at Yale College studying Comparative literature, right? Like, a lot of people don't know, especially now that I'm in the entertainment industry. I didn't go to the drama school there. I didn't get my mfa. I was super academic there. But in all of these places, I was kind of able to, you know, put the pedal to the metal and be the best version of myself, which ended up being noteworthy and recognized in myriad ways. And I feel like while the entertainment industry or the smaller sections that I'm currently working in are obviously much bigger and reliant on both opportunity, a little bit of luck and preparation. The way I look at entertainment is no different than an elite space like the Debbie Allen Dance Academy, an elite space like Brentwood School and elite space like Yale. Like, if I do my work and do what I need to at the highest level, I'm most definitely going to stand out and, and make sure that people understand, like, all the type of things that this guy is doing. There aren't other people that can do that. With the particular combination of things like tap dance, being a vocalist, being a performer, and then having all of that kind of like, undergirded by a very conscious and critical perspective regarding, you know, the world and where we're at and wanting to motivate us to a better place. [00:33:20] Speaker C: Absolutely. [00:33:22] Speaker A: Did. [00:33:23] Speaker B: Did you ever see the. The other side of the coin? You could say of like, if I slack off or if I take a few days off or something, like, I'm not gonna get here. Like, did you ever see that other side? Or was it always like, I'm an energetic little kid who also loves to take notes in my little notepad, you know? [00:33:43] Speaker A: I see what you mean. Like, I guess. Are you saying, like, did I see the other side? [00:33:47] Speaker B: Where it's like, was. Was slacking off and, like, was like, you know what? I don't want to work this hard. This is crazy. I don't need to do this. There's an easy, like, let me take the easy path. [00:33:57] Speaker C: Was that ever an instinct that you had to fight back on? [00:34:02] Speaker A: You know, I would never say that that was a true instinct within myself. However, it's definitely a thing that was said about me and, and rarely to my face. But there were mentors of mine that would say things like this and, and, and I would have these sort of, like, opinions circulate, circulating where it was like, oh, he's going to this school and he's, you know, focusing on being. [00:34:26] Speaker C: You know, he hasn't been great back at the dance studio for a long time. [00:34:30] Speaker A: Yeah, like, he's not tap dancing as much as he should be, or he's not doing this or he's not doing that. Right. And at a certain point, this is one of the hard things about like, you know, being excellent at a, as a, at a thing as a child is you're not even, like, your brain isn't capable of separating, like, doing what you know is good for you from doing what, like, the people that you want to impress and your mentor say is good for you. You can't really tell that difference. And it really wasn't until after leaving college that I realized like, oh, shoot. Doing Jelly's Last jam in New York City Center. Right. Like, I have so many wonderful mentors in tap dance that I'm very grateful to. But, well, more than a couple had their opinions on the fact that, like, you know, I was supposed to be carrying this torch and next up in tap dance and we're like, oh, you're throwing it away by not tap dancing at every waking second. However, a lot of these folks aren't necessarily as multi interested or multidisciplinary and don't necessarily understand the value in practicing elsewhere and what that can bring to your art. Right. You know, I think that one of the crazy things about, you know, having like a prodigious gift with a thing is you can cultivate that a lot. But if you're not living a life and experiencing other things to then bring to that, like, yeah, what is a lot of skill without a perspective to express through that. [00:35:56] Speaker C: Absolutely. [00:35:57] Speaker A: And that's, that's my opinion. And of course, I don't know everything, but I, you know, also have a good sense. Right. You know what I mean? And like, also, here's the other side of it, and maybe this is the other, the other side of the coin where it's like sometimes you just have to recognize that you are that nice at a thing. And like, it could take somebody 40 hours to do what you could figure out in one hour, and maybe they won't even get there. And it's like, sucks to suck, bro. Like, this is a blessing. Like, I'm sorry, you know, like, at the end of the day, being comfortable with that. You know what I'm saying? [00:36:32] Speaker B: And you can't, you can't shy away from that, you know? [00:36:35] Speaker A: Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, also, like a lot of, again, what I said earlier at the beginning of, of our conversation, a lot of the greatest tap dancers were also so crazy great singers. They were in movies. You know, I'm saying, you got Gregory Hines, you got Sammy Davis Jr. You got Fred Astaire, you got Kelly, you know what I'm saying? Ginger Rogers, Shirley Temple, you know, all of these massive, massive, uh, performing acts were crazy nice. And I'm definitely leaving folks out. Um, but I say all that to say, like, just because you love a thing the way that you love it, like, everybody's got. It's everybody's own race, you know what I'm saying? I could see somebody and say, I think they should be doing X, Y and Z, but so long as they believe they're doing what they need to do to be the best version of them, it don't even matter now how I feel, right? Like me chasing the best version of me, I feel like that's a real good version against other people's best versions, you know what I'm saying? And that's probably my. My sports perspective, my very competitive, you know, I'm saying self revealing itself. But at the end of the day, that's what I loved about track, right? It's you versus you. It's you versus your best time and how you work, how you start to, like, you know, you get big improvements to start, but then it's fine tuning and getting a tenth and a twentieth and whatever and like, just keeping at that. You kind of have to be a little bit, like, maniacal about it and love it, but, like, you then look back and you're like, oh, wow, I didn't have nearly any of this, like, you know, 15 months ago, you know what I'm saying? And, like, looking at my past, you know, year I graduated was working in video production, right? Wyatt, you came to my job. I'll never forget this. I'm always so grateful. And you helped me tape for Jelly's Last jam, and then I ended up booking that show. Very grateful to my job. They let me work remote and do it. But following that, right, Like. [00:38:42] Speaker C: And I'm still taking credit for that, to be honest. That's. [00:38:45] Speaker A: And you should. And you should, you should. You should take even more. But it's like now I've done. [00:38:51] Speaker B: I wrote your Yale essays. [00:38:52] Speaker A: The exact. Yes, that's 100% right. That's 100% right. Yeah. And I already have my degree, so y' all can't take it for from me. But no, dude, it's like I've done done five shows, five equity productions at this point, joined the union, you know what I'm saying? I guest starred in a TV show doing this choreography work. Now I'm getting up to more. You know what I'm saying? Like, a lot like, you know, and you're. You're always thinking, damn, I want this next. I want this next. I want this next. But it's also important to recognize, right, like, oh, shoot. Keeping at it has resulted in the building blocks. You know what I'm saying? I just trying to stack more blocks. [00:39:29] Speaker C: I want to. I'm curious if you feel sometimes the same way that I do, which is that I do a lot of things and I spend my. My time off of my main job doing a lot of other things. And I have this like, thing that's like, I'm never doing enough, you know, like, that's just a consistent thing that I have felt. And it's like I have accepted that part of myself because I think it's an important driver a lot of the time. It's the way I was raised. Like, that's not something that I'm. That I'm gonna shake. Yes. I find ways to figure out how to enjoy life at the same time. But do you feel the same way in terms of, you know, if I'm just going towards this, towards music, I should also be doing this and things like, like, are you consciously thinking of building your own business and treating yourself like, I do this, this, and this? And if one part, you know, isn't as nurtured, then at least I have the other two, three things for sure. [00:40:32] Speaker A: For sure. I think funny enough, this year was like, I was working. I jumped from job to job. Like, I would end like, I wrapped shooting a TV show the next day, flew out, started rehearsal for a musical, wrapped that musical, next day, went out on tour, wrapped that at the end of December holiday week, and then was in rehearsal for another thing. And so funny enough, these past couple months have been like, closing at the La Jolla Playhouse. April, May and June have kind. They were open at the top of it, but it was kind of like the first time where I had the opportunity to join some other stuff that I didn't end up doing. I just wasn't necessarily aligned with. And I also wanted the experience of, okay, now that I'm here, what is it going to feel like to not be in a thing? [00:41:22] Speaker C: How do you, like, get in touch with yourself again? You know, like, is. [00:41:26] Speaker A: Dude, it was. It was weird. It was super weird because it's like, you know, I could go and teach some dance. Obviously some opportunities came up and like, that's why it's important to, you know, I mean, like, have a network and be Able to share with people where you are and what you're trying to do. But I'll be honest, it wasn't the most comfortable, you know what I'm saying? It's like, dang, like, you know, you have a job and you have a check coming in and you know what I'm saying? Like, stuff feels all right at the very least. It's like, you know, you're not losing money, but then you, as soon as, you know I'm saying it's three weeks and you haven't had that direct deposit hit and you're like, okay, shoot, like, how am I about to go do this? Whatever. But the point is if one, on the practical side of things, if you need to make a dollar, you can, you know what I'm saying, like, do it in a healthy way for yourself. But I wouldn't ever let that, you know, I'm saying like, stress is important in that regard. And like, well, stress is the wrong word. Maybe urgency is important in that regard where it's like, let's not unless you're blessed and you don't have to worry about it. Like, you should always have a plan and always have a budget. But it was interesting insofar that it was like, okay, I actually can focus my time in a totally self guided way. Be it with training, be it with auditioning for certain things, be it with expressing myself on certain different projects, an entirely different way than when I was a part of a show, right? Because that is a job. You're there in rehearsal hours and hours and then once the show's open, that's your evenings, you're going to have put ins and you're going to have like, you know, I'm saying, review rehearsals and contingency and whatnot. And so like, you know, your job's your job. What I would say to what you're saying about, oh, I'm not doing enough, it's hard not to tell yourself that. And I think anytime we hear somebody saying that about themselves, like when I, when I hear you say that, like, I would never know why it's sarcasian to be a person who's not doing enough, you know what I'm saying? Like, even if we weren't cool, you know what I'm saying? Like there's those people that we know where it's like, I know that on the couch right now, that's not you. You're always doing a thing. And even if that includes going on a run and taking care of yourself or spending time with people that you love or going and watching a piece that's going to inspire you or maybe a piece that you don't like and you're challenging yourself to say outside of just, I didn't like this, putting a finger on why. So that you can also identify that in things that you go on to work on. Like, you're working on yourself in all of these ways. You know what I mean? That was the thing that I tried to do. I tried to go and see a lot of plays, musicals, check out art, you know what I'm saying? Read a bunch while I'm not a part of a production. So I say all that to say I think it's healthy to keep yourself honest. Yeah. But I also, I, I think, I think it's just as important to practice being kind to yourself too. [00:44:34] Speaker C: Absolutely. And I think it's, it's, it's just like a mindset, you know, switch. It's. Instead of I'm not doing enough, it's, oh, what, what else can I do to nurture different parts of myself? You know? Like, I think that's, that's the way I, I try to see it. It's like, okay, I have like a, a free night. Like, don't hate myself for having a free night. Like, like, go, go see a show. Go enjoy something. And like, you know, things like that. It's constantly a thing that I, that I think I struggle with. [00:45:08] Speaker A: I even think about it, like, say you're working out and you're doing push ups or pull ups and you're going to failure. Right? Like, you might, you might have to. If, like, you know, the job requires boom. But if every single set of yours is like, oh, I'm gonna go to, I'm gonna do 20 pull ups right now, and then the next time I'm gonna try, like, that's gonna diminish. The returns are just gonna diminish, diminish, diminish until you actually hurt yourself. [00:45:35] Speaker C: You're gonna get injured. You don't want to do a damage. [00:45:37] Speaker A: Yeah. You feel me? So at that point, you know, if you consider your creativity as a muscle, which I think a lot of people should. Right. Like, we all have limits, you know what I'm saying? And we need to make sure that obviously we want it to be pouring out of us. And the people that have figured out how to turn that on or keep that faucet going in a way, I think obviously they have gifts, but at the same time, I think they're just as talented at figuring out their, their limits and recognizing the correct conditions to have their art spill out of them. [00:46:13] Speaker C: Right. [00:46:13] Speaker A: And, like, just as big a part of that battle is figuring out, oh, you know, they might like to go and eat some tasty every other day or, you know what I'm saying, go play some tennis or go, you know, I mean, whatever somebody's thing is. Watch Love Island. I don't know, you know, like that, like, it could be anything. [00:46:34] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:46:36] Speaker A: But I. I think it's crucial. And so I say all to say it's something that I for sure, you know, struggle with as well, because it's hard not to look at whoever's doing whatever it is, like, on the Internet or they're at whatever age. [00:46:50] Speaker C: That's a whole other thing. Yeah. [00:46:53] Speaker A: You know, and. And I think the reminder. Right. Is like, they're not you, you're not them. It legitimately is your race. And I think the more things that you do as well, like, you also have to recognize, like, your own, like, ceiling and horizon. Right. Like, if you're creating, you're going to be creating until you're out of here. You know what I mean? Like, especially as far as film and television go. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? People break. This is a really wonderful example. Mentor of mine, big homie of mine. Her name is Shanaka Hodge. Her and her brother Choukuti, who's also a phenomenal musician and artist. Choukuti's a constant collaborator of, you know, acts like Childish, Gambino, Logic, Ludwig Goranson. He's, like, responsible for all of the drum arrangement and whatnot on the Black Panther movies. He's dope. Love Chikuti and his sister Shanaka, like, poet laureate. They're all from Oakland. Amazing writer. Got into screenwriting, writing for television, was kind of a part of things and whatnot. Like, definitely was. Was a writer on notable shows like Snowpiercer. But Shanaka's, you know, at least how people will constitute it. Big break just came as she is the. She is definitely the creator and I believe the showrunner of Ironheart on Disney. The new Ryan Coogler executive produced, like, wow, Black Girl, Iron man spin off. Right. And she has a beautiful daughter and a beautiful family, and they live very close to me here in Leimer Park. But she is, you know, I'm not. I'm not gonna, you know, guess at her age, but she's definitely not in our age group. And she was grinding and doing notable things in her 20s, now into her 30s and has started a family and a lot of People would say, you know, oh, this is a big break for her now to create other shows and more stories that she would want to create outside of, like, the conglomerate context. Right. So I use her as an example because, one, it's super inspiring, but to this work that she's done and she's put in, like, obviously there's a lot of high profile, sort of, like, Hollywood attention on this one thing, but again, the support of that and. And the fundamental thing that pushed her to this moment is all the work that she was doing. And now this is going to be a baseline for the next stuff that she goes on to do. Right. You know, so. And I. I can imagine, you know, there's. There's interviews of hers out there. I'll send y' all some stuff afterwards. But her talking about, like, her process, her being kind to herself, you know, the neuroses we all experience as creatives. Right. Like, definitely has her own battles with that, but she is, you know, flying right now, and I'm super excited to see the next things that she creates. And, like, again, she's well beyond where we're at in terms of just, like, life, you know, I'm saying, like, has started a family and is reaching this point. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, very true about what we're doing. I. Another example, cut me off if needed, but I was doing some assistant choreography on Bel Air, you know, the Bel Air Fresh Prince of Bel Air spin off TV show a couple weeks ago, was working with the actors Jabari Banks and Ali Sholatan, who play Will Smith and Carlton, respectively. Great guys. They're doing a little duo dance to pay homage to one of the original actors episodes. But the head writer of that show is this amazing dude. And I recognize. I was like, I feel like I recognize you. He was an actor on Insecure. I'm blanking on his name right now because we caught up a little bit. But really, really kind guy. Turns out he went to Harvard, Westlake, went to NYU, was an actor in New York for 10 years, got into the TV thing, and now he's fully transitioned to being one of the two writers on. On this entire season of a massive, you know, peacock TV show shot at Universal called Bel Air. Right. And another dude who has, like, a young kid who's, like, you know, in one of the private schools out here and, like, is only just realizing this part of his career, you know what I'm saying? So as writers, as creatives, you know what I'm saying? Like, obviously, we see these like, you know, super flashy. Like, you know, some people was like, damn, like, he's super on, and he's 26, 27. That's way outside the norm. And also, like, so many folks build their career and really get going as far as what y' all are trying to do. The things and the, like, you know, the big projects we're trying to be a part of, the big stories we're trying to tell. You know, I'm saying 40 is young. [00:51:49] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:51:50] Speaker A: I spent all that time to say that. You know what I'm saying? So, obviously, we're trying to get it and take the opportunities as we can, but I think the underlying truth to that is the fact that, you know, these people have such a strong command on life and experience. [00:52:06] Speaker C: Exactly. You have to have. [00:52:07] Speaker A: You only get being here this long. You know what I mean? [00:52:10] Speaker C: Yeah, exactly. [00:52:11] Speaker A: You have to live a life that you could bring to the ark. [00:52:13] Speaker C: It would not have worked for them if they were, you know, 26, and everybody has their own timeline, and. And they are so much better now than they would have been when they were, you know, 10 years before. So it's. It's important to literally. And. And on the other side of that, it's important to keep that goal in mind, you know, and not get discouraged. Discouraged by the fact that you are, you know, 24 and not doing the thing that you want to be doing, because that's. That's life. And you're gonna get there eventually if you. If you keep fighting and putting yourself in those positions and maintaining that network and all the things we talk about on the podcast, you know? [00:52:48] Speaker A: Exactly. [00:52:49] Speaker B: So you're. You're at this. This artist camp, and you've had a few months off from the road, the show, all these shows and. And gigs and everything, and you finally have a second to yourself, and you get this opportunity to go to this artist camp, and you know exactly what it is you want. Message wise, you make these five songs. But I want to. I want to. Because we kind of just jumped to, like, you've got five songs out of it. What did the actual. Did you lock in for three days straight? Were you sleeping? Were you not sleeping? Like, what. What did those studio sessions look like? And did the conversations continue? Was it an immediate. Like, these producers get me, and they get what I want, so it just worked. Was there any sort of hiccup? Like, and how did you get over those. Those road bumps? If there were any. [00:53:40] Speaker A: I would honestly say. I wouldn't even necessarily say there were hiccups. I think I kind of. Because of the nature of, like, having to, like, moving and like, being a part of the move in process in New York, but knowing that this was not an opportunity that I could pass up, like, just kind of flew back. Yeah, I would. I would say there weren't really hiccups because I. I came in with, like, not low expectations, but just no expectations and hoping to, you know, play my role. Like, I understood that I was coming in the capacity as an artist, and I knew that these were people, like, who have very big cuts, you know what I'm saying? Like, these are. These are some folks who have worked on some big records that we all know. And I can't say too much prior to, you know, what's to come in terms of, like, what we've worked on. But I knew that they were going to be doing their thing. So my thing was, like, how do I come prepared? I'm going to come vocally warmed up. I'm going to come, you know, with my mind ready and primed, you know, to write, to express and to collaborate. And I guess in that sense, yeah, it was three days straight. We started in afternoons and like, went like, probably, like, you know, start one 2pm would go until a nice little, like, midnight, 1am kind of situation. We're able to get through four songs in the first two days. Then on the last day, kind of like locked in on one because our goal was to get five songs. And I'd say, yeah, like, it was very, very much so, a really great experience because I know it's something I want to do more. I'd love to work with those people again. I'd also love to see what it's like to work with other teams. Like, they kind of, you know, they had their system down pat and I really appreciated it. They were very. [00:55:26] Speaker B: So did they set the time you felt like you were kind of coming into their space or it felt very, like, collaborative. [00:55:34] Speaker A: Yeah, I was definitely coming into their space. I was definitely, definitely coming into their space. But it was collaborative in the sense that, like, you know, they're trying to kind of like, create like a bespoke, like, tailored song, you know, I mean, like, in the same way that like, an atelier would make like a. Like some pants or some shoes or something like that. So it's not like they were just like, okay, let us make some type of song. We kind of talked about it afterwards. Once we were done with everything, they were like, you know, sometimes an artist comes in, doesn't give anything so we just kind of have to make something, and they might say they like it, or they might make a whole song, and then they'll be like, I don't really like this, but as somebody who writes, produces a lot of my own stuff already, it's kind of like those hours paid off insofar that I could talk about, you know, structural moments. I could, you know, compose a top line, compose a lyric, help talk about, like, the narrative quality of a song, you know, I'm saying, like, have a very, very active influence on what was being created. And then even on the last day, like, I was able to get on the keyboard, you know, make a. Make a chord progression and, like, dip my. You know, kind of dip into my production experience as well. Right. Because, like, everybody has their roles. A couple. Like, the first day I came in, he kind of had his producer, kind of had two tracks ready that were both crazy. And then we kind of got to talk about, you know, more references and more things in the build on the next days. But I would say it definitely was very truly collaborative in the sense where it was like, they're coming in. Like, I was simultaneously like, the artists and the brief. But not an artist with, like, a, you know, super expansive musical history or, like, brand history yet. Right. Rather somebody who's on the precipice of building that. So I think that made it easier for sure. [00:57:26] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:57:27] Speaker A: Kind of excited them to work with an artist who at least was as invested in the creation of the material and had fun doing that part of it. [00:57:38] Speaker C: Totally. [00:57:38] Speaker A: Was also someone who, like, oh, shoot, like, you can really dance, you can really sing. Like, I can't tell you how many times they were like, man, we're excited to work with you because you can actually sing, you know, and you know what you want, you know, like, yeah. [00:57:51] Speaker C: That'S probably the most important part you were able to communicate to them. And it takes it right back to the thing of you've produced, you know, you. You can play chords on the keyboard. Like, it's. It's these things that, you know, you. You think in the moment, like, oh, I'm just doing all these things. But it really does help. [00:58:08] Speaker A: A lot of people would, Would. Would have said and did say back after graduating from high school that I didn't need to go to college, that I should have started just performing, doing whatever, and I. Would I have been all right. Would I been able to make money? For sure. But, you know, I think, like, going to school and studying what I did and being around people who are committed to, you know, being at the height of excellence in whatever their field is, like, really forces you to, like, kind of like, level up and consider yourself in the same frame. And like you said, being able to communicate and relate with creatives or express yourself in such a way that, you know, hopefully you're 90% understood versus 35% understood. Right. Like, in any, any artistic or even just like, you know, business capacity, you can't really work with somebody that can't explain themselves or the thing that they're trying to sell. You know what I mean? [00:58:58] Speaker C: Yes. [00:58:59] Speaker A: Or trying to create. [00:58:59] Speaker C: You're not buying their script, you're not buying their anything. [00:59:02] Speaker A: You know, that's my thing. So it's like, regardless of how it's shaken out, like, you know, I'm, I'm very happy with where I'm at and I'm, I'm. I'm very proud of the work I've been able to do. And I, I feel like, you know, it's funny, I was, I was back at school and was talking to, you know, someone who was on the, the board at Yale about kind of like my, you know, post grad experience, but also what I studied, because they're always surprised, too, that I didn't, you know, do theater studies or do, you know what I mean, like, like music or dance or something like that. And this old guy is a book publisher. He goes, oh, wow, you are just so well rounded, you know. And like, it's such, it was such a funny thing to hear, but it was like, damn. I mean, I guess that's. That is the choice that I made on a certain level. It was like, man, I wanted to work on my ideology, my philosophy, the way I internalize narrative before expressing it while keeping up my tools of expression, too. And now, you know, a lot of that is, you know, beginning to emerge, and I'm just, you know, keeping at it and, and, and waiting on one of those projects that's going to be like that big, big swing, you know? [01:00:19] Speaker C: Absolutely. [01:00:19] Speaker A: But we're rocking it, you know, we're rocking it. Until then, I know that y' all are doing the same. So I appreciate you, like, you know, chatting with me about this because as much as I'm, you know, locked in what I'm doing, there's not a moment that I'm not checking out every single thing that you guys create and are continuing to. It's super inspiring. [01:00:38] Speaker C: So what's next for all in One? Where are you headed now? You're moving to New York? [01:00:44] Speaker A: Exactly. [01:00:45] Speaker C: Are you gonna be doing more theater stuff out there, continuing with music? What's exciting? [01:00:49] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. At least in terms of theater. I have a next project. I'm doing a show called Spunk. It's a play written by Zora Neale Hurston, who's one of the most celebrated African American and woman authors in the American modern American canon. This is the first time that this play is ever being staged. There are some particulars about why on the Internet. I have to do, like, more serious research, but my understanding is there were complications staging it, and then it reverted back to copyright. But this piece was written 90 years ago, and this is the first time it's being staged, which is amazing. At the Yale Repertory Theater. So I get to go home. I get to study under. And with a lot of the, you know, most talented, you know, MFA candidate actors in our country, a lot of whom go on and do really, really notable stuff right after they leave. And I'm sure that's gonna be the case for a lot of my castmates and peers. The director, Ms. Tamel, or I should say Professor Tamela Woodard, she's the chair of the acting program within Geffen, which is the drama school. So I'm gonna be definitely trying to soak up as many of those, you know, MFA nutrients as I can. And the character I'm playing is. His name's Blue Trout. He's very musical. He can play instruments. He can tap dance, which obviously makes a good candidate for the show. And I think, you know, the show kind of deals with, as does the literature of Zora Neale Hurston, who I actually studied during my time, you know, as a compared complex major deals with, you know, the trials and tribulations of black experience in the American South. Be it with love, be it with religion, be it with, you know, sort of intersectionality and, like, you know, the sort of diversity within the black experience and how socioeconomic barriers can, you know, impose themselves, how, like, you know, certain black people can emulate white supremacy and white supremacist structures to subjugate one another. I think that all of those things and more are being covered. So in a very real way, this is like a play that is most connected to the thing and the things that I studied as an undergrad, right. Because I wrote my thesis about black diaspora. [01:03:27] Speaker C: You know, talk about the intersection. I mean, it's what you were learning when you were six, right? The intersection of academics and art. Like, it's. It's right there. And it's the reason why you chose to go to school after, after high school and all of that. And it did help you, you know, totally. [01:03:43] Speaker A: And I think, you know, even if I didn't know it at that time, it's like, you know, you can't help who you are. You can't help finding interesting the things that you do find interesting. And luckily for me, even just understanding tap dance as an allegory for this entire conversation, right, like that is the intersection of African, African American, you know, immigrant culture. There's deep layers of cultural appropriation and there's not really a time in history, in the history of tap dance that you can't talk about, you know, the appropriation of, you know, this truly African American and black art form, be it looking at it today, a decade ago, 50 years ago, from the beginning, I mean, like people talking about who invented it, how it happened, you know what I mean? Like there's all of these very. There are truths about how this happened and then there are rewritings and retellings and you know, very often do we say a thing that is black or African American is, you know, watered down to be an American art form and the faces are, you know, kind of privileged alongside that aren't necessarily reflective of the actual genealogy of the tradition. So I'm fascinated to be a part of a piece that does that and then even more so once I'm finished with that project, being in New York to workshop and be around for the new pieces that are coming forward and hopefully helping build some things that have their own legacy and allow me to introduce myself as somebody who is generative of new work and essential in pushing the needle for a thing to be successful with my own intrinsic qualities. [01:05:31] Speaker C: Yeah, I think specifically, specifically with your, with your own personal projects. You're asking the question of, of how can I showcase all of my talents through this piece? You know, I'm sure if it's an album, it's not just going to be an album. You know, it's going to be visuals, it's going to be dancing, it's going to be all of that. So that's, that's one of the things I appreciate about you. [01:05:54] Speaker A: Absolutely. [01:05:55] Speaker C: Well, it seems like you have a lot on the horizon. I'm curious we're going to end this soon because I just want to be conscious of time. [01:06:01] Speaker A: Yeah, take, take the time that you. [01:06:04] Speaker C: Need though, is, is there a piece of advice you would tell yourself? You know, tell six year old Aleman or five year old All Aman when you're, you know, doing some jumping and tumbling on the mats and you're, and you're just looking ahead at this, all of this exploration and career. Is there a piece of advice that you would give to yourself? [01:06:26] Speaker A: Yeah, I think this reverts back to what I was saying about feeling, right. I would tell my young self, right, like the joy, the excitement, the, even the disappointment and not being able to do or get a thing, but like committing yourself to like attaining a skill and training hard. Like trust those feelings and feel them well and don't let you know someone else's quote unquote position or experience or authority over a situation or a thing that you're a part of. Be the end all. Be all of you know, why you make a decision or what you're allowed to feel. You know what I mean? I think too often we look at somebody in their, you know, their career, their position or you know, their skill and you know, take their word as gospel. Now do we always have things to learn? Yes. And should we maintain self criticism? Yes. But I would just say don't accept anything uncritically. If somebody's telling you something is great, thank you, back your head, be like, why are they saying it's great? What do they see? You know what I'm saying? Like, do they want to, you know, job next? Like, you know what I'm saying? Like who knows what it is? Or are they telling you, am I, are they telling me this is tight so I don't push that extra, you know, 10 yards, that extra 10 gear, you know what I'm saying? Like, and that's again, I start to sound like a broken record. That's when it's like being honest with yourself and being honest about your own race. Right, but that would be the advice. Yeah, I would say like, you know, just because somebody has their respect and has done their thing and, and, and has made them, made themselves into a thing that's widely respected. Like what worked for them, worked for them. Right. Don't let their, their wisdom or their advice or their, you know, whatever they say to you both build up or destroy your internal world or universe, you know what I mean? Because I think that happened to me when I was a kid and it made my relationship with expressing art in certain mediums that I really love very complicated. And it made me step away and come back and whatnot. And so yeah, trust that feeling that you're creating gives you, you know what I'm saying? Like, because that, like, if ergonomic is the wrong word, but if it's like creatively ergonomic. Like, that's probably the thing that you should keep doing. Like, if somebody's telling you to make something or do something or, like, stop doing a thing and it, like, hurts to stop that, there's no reason to do that. You should not. Like, that's a. That's a bad thing. That's the best way I can articulate that. Like, that is bad. So, yeah, really be aware of your feeling and trust. Trust how your creative experience interacts with, like, your soul, your body. Like, and make sure that's. That's. [01:09:30] Speaker B: I think. I think, like, the current spot you're in though, right? Like, every episode for us is like, how to. And then insert, you know, what guest is. Is kind of what path they're on or what the spot they're in currently. And, like, I think for you, like, at least a lot of our conversations, it's. In this industry, it's all about finding your pocket and, like, starting in that pocket and then being able to branch out, you know, at least having, like, one, like, space to really establish yourself in and using that to, like, really, again, branch out, build out from that. But I think for you, like, you're just proving that, like, by being so knowledgeable and by, like, being very critical, but also, like, asking yourself these big questions of, like, your brand as Alaman. If anything, that is your foundation. Like, that is. Is kind of your building block. Like, that's your pocket kind of thing. And then you're at the stage where you're able to build out and do again. It's not a ton of things. It's like these three very specific things that aren't that crazy different from each other. Again, you were saying at the artist camp, it's like, I'm in the studio and I'm thinking about how I'm performing this. I'm thinking about the narrative or with the video or what the visuals are going to look like. Like, I'm pulling all of these skills together to, like, benefit the thing in front of me. Like, output is output as an artist. And I think you are at a point, again, where you understand the message and what you want to say with your work. And that work can be whether it's music or on the stage or, like, is in theater, Broadway, or on the screen, you know? [01:11:08] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:11:08] Speaker B: So it makes sense. And I think you answered that question is how to do a few things at once. And it's like, figure out what you want to say, you know? [01:11:17] Speaker A: Yeah, I think. Yeah. How do you center yourself between your avenues of expression between your talents, between your interests. Right? Like, I think very often it's human nature to we sort ourselves into categories, and we sort people that we meet into categories. So the way you meet somebody is how you're going to think of them until they show, shift that understanding or they do something else that makes you put them in a different frame. But the reality is, like, the me that you see doing some theater, the me that you see playing a live music gig, the me that you see choreographing the me that you see on tv, it's all me, right? So it is up to me to do the work, to, like, you know, build it to a place where people just expect any of those. You know what I'm saying? But so long as you know that yourself, right? Like, you're not validated by the thing that you're doing, but you're validated by the artist that you are that can go and do any of these things, then it's not so hard to just be like, no, I can't do that right now. Like, sorry, I, like, thank you for the offer to be in your musical, but I'm working on this choreography or I'm working on my artist project and I have some gigs set up or whatever it is. Right. Like, I do think, you know, the human is the sauce as a precursor to that, you know, AI conversation. But I genuinely do think that it is us. We are the center of it. And like, of course, when you go and work in one space, you're bringing your experience from the other mediums and absolutely of. Of expression. And so, yeah, I think it's essentializing that and kind of being. Not letting that even be a negotiation, you know what I'm saying? Like, that's who you're hiring. And honestly, sometimes that's going to be a problem for folks. Sometimes they're just going to want the person. That's just one thing, right? And you have to be comfortable knowing that, like, then that wasn't my gig or that wasn't my job, you know what I'm saying? Because, yeah, you're getting more. Now you also have to be a professional. You're not, you know. [01:13:39] Speaker C: Well, I was going to say, but, you know, totally. At the end of the day, it's like, it's about. [01:13:45] Speaker A: Some people might be intimidated. [01:13:47] Speaker C: You know, it's the internal. Right. I, like, in. [01:13:50] Speaker A: In. [01:13:50] Speaker C: In my position, I. I have my job where I. I execute specific skills that I have, but I'm not just that. And maybe they hired me just to execute, execute those skills. And that's great. But then I can slowly start putting in other skills and showcasing different parts of myself. And you know, outside of the job, I can exercise different muscles and things like that. So I think it's like, it's, it's about finding, it's about, you know, keeping all those things in shape. Right. If we're using the muscle metaphor. But it's also about. [01:14:22] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:14:22] Speaker C: Continuing to look internal internally and being like, I am more than just this. I am doing this. I am doing this. I'm doing all these things. Like, if you're on Broadway and you're performing eight times a week, you're not going to be able to record music or do all of that as much as you want to. But keep that in mind, you know that this is still. [01:14:40] Speaker A: However, you can have your daytime. Because that's the thing that I like about theater. So long as you, as you have things squared away and they, they're not entitled to you during the day, show up at 7 o', clock, half hour call or 6:30. If your show's at 7, you do your show. [01:14:58] Speaker C: Yeah. [01:14:58] Speaker A: You have from when you wake up to whenever else. And if you're diligent and you like obviously have a regiment, exercise in the morning, have an efficient three hour studio session. You could absolutely and very feasibly cut a whole project in a week of show. So. [01:15:16] Speaker C: Absolutely. [01:15:16] Speaker A: But that's how my brain goes. It's like, damn. Like I want to, you know I'm saying, like I want to, I want to actually go do that. You know what I'm saying? [01:15:22] Speaker C: We could get into the weeds of schedules all day. Yeah, yeah. [01:15:26] Speaker A: You know, I, I know that that's what she's on. You know what I'm saying? Cynthia Revo is crazy. Have you seen Talk about, talk about distance running? She's like, oh my God, like marathon stuff. [01:15:37] Speaker C: She's insane. [01:15:38] Speaker A: That's an athlete. [01:15:39] Speaker C: That's, that's the thing I have, I have said I just don't have the time to train for a marathon. And then you see Cynthia Rivo doing it. [01:15:47] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:15:47] Speaker C: And you're like, oh, I do have the time to train for a marathon. I just need to learn. [01:15:51] Speaker A: Right. Or could. And to be fair, she's definitely in a place where she's doing what she wants. [01:15:56] Speaker C: Yeah. [01:15:57] Speaker A: Outside the bounds of that check. It's tough. That Cynthia check is cool. We need that. [01:16:03] Speaker C: Yeah, I know, I know. [01:16:08] Speaker A: We need that one. Oh, yeah. [01:16:10] Speaker C: All right, dude. Well, we've, we've taken around an hour and a half of your time, so we really appreciate you coming on. No, thanks for joining us on the podcast. And you, you're a supporter of the festival, too. You've been at most of the festivals, so. [01:16:22] Speaker A: No, when I'm in town, I'm there. You already know. You already know. I love to see what you guys have built. It's awesome. When is the next. Is it October? [01:16:30] Speaker B: Is it October 19th? Yes. [01:16:32] Speaker C: Yep. [01:16:33] Speaker A: I'll still be. I'll still be performing. I have one more week of shows, so I won't be there, but I will, of course, be supporting from afar. [01:16:42] Speaker C: Okay, well, we would prefer if you would be there, but. [01:16:45] Speaker A: I know. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. [01:16:48] Speaker C: That's okay. [01:16:49] Speaker A: I'll be there in spirit. Ooh. Is there. Is there anything new about this iteration? Where. Where is it happening? Any info that we can give to me slash, the viewers. Listeners? [01:17:09] Speaker B: It's gonna be great, man. It's gonna be big. [01:17:12] Speaker C: It's gonna be the biggest. [01:17:14] Speaker B: It's. It's. There's a lot in store. We're gonna have. There's a lot. [01:17:22] Speaker C: Almond, how did. How bad did you feel missing the Kyle Mooney Festival? [01:17:29] Speaker A: You know, genuinely, I was like, damn, that would have been so crazy to. [01:17:34] Speaker C: See you and you and Kyle in the same room. Oh, my God. Just so much awkwardness. [01:17:43] Speaker A: Would have gotten pretty weird, you know? But I will say it gave me probably the biggest smile of that entire week, because I was like, damn, this is exactly what's supposed to happen. And, like, I'm sure you guys talked to him and told him how much he meant to, because y' all showed me Kyle for sure. Like, I was not hip to that dude before y' all showing me his. His excellent work. And I'm a particular fan of his. His work at the sports parades. Those are awesome. But, you know, it was like, it's perfect. And, like, what a testament to, like, you know, his career. The fact that he could inspire, you know, yalls, just, like, general humor, but also the work that you want to do. But then the fact that you guys have built a thing that merited him pulling up and supporting and seeing, right? Like, yeah. I was like, damn, this is exactly what's supposed to happen. So obviously, would have loved to be there, but it did not change in any way. Sort of like the happiness and own personal gratification I felt just seeing that and just being like, damn, yeah, y' all are cooking. [01:18:54] Speaker B: And we feel that, man. [01:18:56] Speaker A: He's pulling up, and, like, we feel. [01:18:58] Speaker B: The support and now it's for sure. Now it's right back at you, man. [01:19:01] Speaker A: You know, but the understanding, right? It's like y' all are peers with him now as well. Even if you're honoring him. Like, he knows who y' all are. Y' all are on his radar and it's mutual, you know what I'm saying? So that's far from. From the last time y' all are going to be in rooms with Mr. Kyle. But that's. That was so crazy. I was. I was so hyped to see it. I was so, so hyped to see. [01:19:23] Speaker C: It was pretty cool. [01:19:24] Speaker A: I can't wait to see what y' all do next. For sure. [01:19:26] Speaker B: Thanks, man. [01:19:27] Speaker C: Appreciate it. [01:19:34] Speaker B: Did you learn something? I'm like your mom. Did you learn something in this episode? I hope so. Or not. That's okay. Thanks for hanging. Make sure you follow us at the 5050Fest on Instagram and give us five stars, because. Why not? Why not subscribe? Why not? You know why not? Okay, bye.